I don't want to lose sight of this, as it seems important. About seven years ago you asked about the Mars genie behind Loyola and Voltaire. As such, I see a lot of Voltaire in you. Have you ever made the distinction? You have the sonnets and plays in your background, as well the Voltaire education; Jesuit for him, Catholic for you. The consideration is rather overwhelming for me, and I don't want to lose it. All, of course, in the modern frame of reference. Here was the comment:
Voltaire was also noted for his satirical humor, and could be a vicious critic, like with Christianity. Tom is noteworthy for his, "Mythery of Golgotha", but he grew up Catholic, which could have something to do with it. Loyola's past can be traced to Muhammad, who brought the Koran out of the cave when he was forty, c. 610 AD. He was close to the influences of the Academy of Jundi-Shapur, and possessed a kind of premature consciousness soul, which facilitated his inspirations through the Archangel Gabriel. As Steiner indicates in GA 184, the religious system of Islam, based on the Koran, served to "skim the cream off the top of the Academy of Jundi-Shapur".
"Above all in those regions where it was wished to spread the Gnostic wisdom of Jundí Sábúr, Mohammed took the ground from under its feet. He skimmed the cream off it, and so the Jundí Sábúr influence was left to trail behind and could accomplish nothing in face of what Mohammed had done. Here you can see the wisdom in world-history; we come to know the truth about Mohammedanism only when, in addition to other things, we know that Mohammedanism was destined to deaden the Gnostic wisdom of Jundí Sábúr, to take from it the strong Ahrimanically seductive force which would otherwise have been exercised upon mankind." GA 184, lecture V
One last item of note concerning the pretext and basis for Rudolf Steiner going to the Realschule in Wiener-Neustadt, Austria, for his middle school education, which is intended to speak volumes to the Gilgamesh incarnation, c. 2500 BC, is that when the boy was eight years old, and living in Pottschach, Hungary, and just before moving to Neudorfl, he had an occult experience while sitting in the Pottschach railway station. A person vaguely familiar walked into the station, and came over to him, and pleaded the words: "Try now and later to do for me as much as you can". Then, she continued to make gestures which imparted deep meaning to the little boy, and then walked over to the heat stove that warmed the office, and disappeared into it. This is the prefiguring event in the life of Rudolf Steiner. This occurrence caused the veritable lifting of the veil in the inception of the so-called, "being of anthroposophy". The little boy felt compelled to make inquiries for the first time in his life. You see, prior to this occurrence, it had all been: "In one ear and out the other", so to speak. So, the boy began to pay attention for the first time in his young life. He soon found out that his parents were both suffering a great tragedy that had just occurred. His aunt, who was his mother's second sister, had committed suicide, and had come to him immediately in her etheric body at the Pottschach location. Her imploring words and gestures had the effect of causing the boy to look at his worldview with a certain character and distinction for the first time. The Being of Anthroposophy was born. This is from the autobiographical lecture of February 4, 1913, given in Berlin, just one day after the lecture that invoked Dante's inspiration of his beloved, "Psychosophia", toward our "Anthroposophia".
It is possible from here to see all the underpinnings. An eight-year old boy suddenly becomes keenly curious about the outside world. His father begins to see a very keen mind at work, and eventually decides to send him to the Aristotle school, rather than the village gymnasium in Neudorfl, where he would have been taught by Cistercian monks. Steiner always considered this a blessing because he got that close to becoming a Cistercian himself. Then, his spiritual science would have become completely self-involved.
So, thanks to the Aunt who died, but instigated the, "Being Anthroposophia". It can be adduced that she was the reincarnated Dante in the nineteenth century, which Steiner had pointed out in the second lecture of GA 138, "Initiation, Eternity, and the Passing Moment". He points out how it was a big deal for him.
Here is what Rudolf Steiner says about this experience at the Pottschach station when he was about eight years old, and his discarnate Aunt came to him in her etheric body:
"Now, someone who experiences something like this in his early childhood and tries to understand it in accordance with the disposition of his soul, knows , if he experiences such a thing consciously, how one lives in the spiritual worlds. And since the instreaming illumination of the spiritual worlds is to be discussed here only in relation to points that are directly necessary, let it be suggested here at once that from that event onward a life in the boy's soul began to develop which thoroughly revealed to him the worlds out of which not only the outer trees, the outer mountains, speak to the human soul but also the worlds that are behind them. From that point in time onward, the boy lived with the spirits of nature, which can be observed quite particularly in such a region; he lived with the creative beings behind things, and he allowed them to work upon him in the same way as he allowed the outer world to work upon him."
Thus, the boy experienced the primal phenomena of the world. He was grafted into the underlying spiritual reality of every outer-external event that occurred, or ever could occur. The birth of Anthroposophy. He soon came to impress his father very much. Yet, the discarnate Aunt was to be the platform for something more. Her etheric appearance guided the boy to an experience that can be explained only out of the principles of spiritual economy. The boy received an astral body copy of the Master Jesus, who is the evolved Zarathustra, and his mission was set. The Autobiography of Rudolf Steiner really does explain this in great detail.
He never lost the spiritual geometry in which spiritual relationships usually decline into the linear and horizontal. Thus, he was initiated at a very young age. When he began to attend the Real Schule at age 11, he experienced a profound reminder of something that had happened once upon a time. He wrote about it when he was nearly 63 years old. By this time, it was a profound clue.
Yes, I know this is how you equate this experience, but I don't see Anthroposophia coming in until after Steiner sees that his teacher who was Plato in his last life couldn’t bring Anthroposophy into the world. He gives Steiner the opportunity to take up the Goethe relationship with guidance from the other side.
& then, when Steiner meets Marie, Anthroposophia comes in as a Cosmic Being, grounding that Being on earth for the 1st time.
The above quote is a powerful example of Steiner’s atavistic clairvoyance, which he then re-works thru the Rosicrucian path.
Yes, Karl Julius Schroer was one of the emissaries in the life path of Rudolf Steiner, beginning with the aunt, Felix, the layman that encouraged the Fichte studies, and then the Master himself. But, Steiner's clairvoyance was never atavistic, just a natural clairvoyance out of the state of "unbornness", which became more and more exact over the course of his life. Thus, Steiner was the very first to possess and display this future faculty of humanity. It marks our path of striving in this New Abraham Epoch.
"Frau Doctor Wegman was / is / & will continue to be, a co-worker with Rudolf Steiner – having served with him thru-out many life-times together."
This continues to be a matter of speculation. For example, Cratylus was not at Ephesus at the time of Heraclitus, but was a younger associate of Socrates some fifty years later, c. 430 BC. As such, Cratylus is immortalized in a dialogue of Plato, which Aristotle knew of, and made comment on, c. 360 BC. So, you see, this creates doubt concerning your whole thesis of past lives. "World History...." only brings us closer to Gilgamesh and Eabani, and their continuation at the Mystery of Ephesus, and then the historically relevant figures of Aristotle and Alexander some 150 years later, c. 384 & 356 BC. It is the three or four years that Aristotle taught the young Alexander that is most important. The intensity of it caused Alexander to completely remember his incarnation at Ephesus, and he attained self-realization for his mission as King of Macedonia. As such, he would spread the Aristotelian Knowledge of Nature as his conquering sword, and create the Hellenistic Corridor to the Promised Land for the Hebrews.
He was the Maitreya Bodhisattva, and duly prepared by Aristotle. Yes, they did have a keen and close legacy.
The Maitreya connection was inserted especially to get your attention. You see, Steiner in his lectures on the Gospel of Mark, speaks of the comets of Buddha and Socrates. This is important because the comet of Gautama Buddha points back to his predecessor, who is Krishna, and the comet of Socrates points forward to John the Baptist, and Christ. This also is meant to indicate the passing of the Tiara from the Buddha to his successor, who is the Maitreya incarnation, which is Socrates. Yes, a philosopher succeeds Gautama Buddha. It is no less than Socrates. He especially sees the Aristotle- Alexander connection, and why he fuels the dialogues through Plato, who is his medium of contact.
Remember, Rudolf Steiner describes all this without inferring himself or Ita Wegman in it. Why should we? If Cratylus was not there at Ephesus, then does it not cause suspicion concerning the other entities? Again, for example. Rudolf Steiner as far as I know, never referred to Sigune or Schionatulander anywhere. And, Thomas Aquinas does not redeem Aristotle because *he* is Aristotle, but because he becomes the 12th in the College of Twelve with regard to the birth of Christian Rosenkreutz. This is described here in lecture 6 of GA 237, The School of Chartres, wherein Alain de Lille in old age prepares the birth of Thomas Aquinas for a special mission in the 13th century. The College of Twelve that surrounds the birth of Christian Rosenkreutz. So, there is a riddle here that links Aquinas to Aristotle.
Once only did Aristotle and Alexander pay a fleeting visit to the earth in the first Christian centuries in a district not without interest for the Anthroposophical Movement. This visit together was their last time. Then, they returned to the spiritual world to continue to move forward. - Rudolf Steiner (sic)
“Christian doctors of the Church, their souls equipped with Aristotle, battling against those who had carried the other Aristotle across from Asia into Spain, spreading an unchristian doctrine. On all hands we see the conflict of Aristotelianism in the Christian fathers of the Church, we see it in the pictures that were painted in a later time, the Church fathers holding in their hand what they had gained from Aristotle, and treading under foot Averröes and the others who stood for their kind of Aristotelianism that had come through Alexandrianism into Europe. This was taking place externally. But at the same time, if we may describe it out of spiritual research, Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor lived on, having passed through the gate of death as I just indicated, and needless to say, Alexander and Aristotle themselves lived on. Once only they paid as it were a fleeting visit to the earth in the first Christian centuries in a district not without interest for the Anthroposophical Movement. Then they returned again into the spiritual world and they were together in the spiritual world at a certain time after Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor had left the physical plane once more. They themselves, the real individualities of Aristotle and Alexander, took different paths from Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor. For they went forward with the Christian evolution. They went westward with the evolution of Christianity.”
So, this would seem to further indicate that these supposed Steiner-Wegman incarnations are bogus. Yet, it is true that Rudolf Steiner as a boy went to school in the Burgenland of Austria, for seven years (1872-1879); a Realschule in the mold of Aristotle. His father thought he would make a good railway engineer.
Yes, a few people have come to believe that, but what if it can be shown that the incarnation is several centuries earlier, and closer to Christ? As well, if this was their last incarnation together, then this leaves out Aquinas-Piperno, and Steiner-Wegman. They went west with Christianity, but separately, after this final incarnation.
Thank you once again for your courageous words today in the karma of exclusion. I really wonder how this tendency manages to continue into our times? This tendency to form polarized ‘cliques’ among Anthroposophists has always kept me somewhat aloof. When I ventured into deeper involvement, each time I felt pressured to join one clique against another. I'd witness people acting out of their double to covertly accuse others of behaviors they themselves indulged. It was painful. I’ve never understood why this happens so frequently among Anthropops. I’ve experienced nothing like that in the Christian Community or among BD folks. Do you think it’s still the conflict between Aristotelians and Platonists, or do you think there is a long shadow from RS lifetime that is still cast into our age? I have a feeling it’s an imbalance that develops from people who only study and don’t do any inner meditative work, or psychological work… Oh well, just wanted to thank you as ever, for your profound insights and wake up call!
Greetings Lady D - I do think part of the imbalance stems from a lack of self-knowledge, as you say, because folks would rather keep Steiner’s teachings theoretical & so that connects to the conflict between the Aristotelians & Platonists, & the lack of interest in working with Christ as Lord of Karma.
And perhaps it’s true that the sins of the original Vorstand linger…
The inner meditative, psycho-spiritual work is required, now more than ever, as the incarnation of Ahriman descends.
In all truthfulness, and I like Diana's sentiments of the psychological baggage, it is really about people not doing the work. They make up excuses instead, and then wonder why it is falling apart, and being too theoretical. In reality, Rudolf Steiner advocated studying spiritual science every day in total conformity to the conceptual framework of the Intellectual Soul. This was the main gateway. No clairvoyance required at all. Then, what gets revealed soon after this takes place is how the soul begins to partake in a new process; the process of the Consciousness Soul. So, there can be no fault other than not doing the work of the acquisition of new knowledge. The so-called, "daughter movements ", which began in earnest in 1919, e.g., Waldorf, Threefolding, Anthro Medicine, Biodynamics, Camphill, were designed to give an outer expression to this theoretical/ conceptual framework. It would be wrong to point to it as causing the "karma of exclusion" in the destiny of Ita Wegman. In reality, it was Marie Steiner who ditched her, and she never explained it Likely, female jealousy, to give a convenient answer. The world turned on it.
With your indication of Marie Steiner’s jealousy, you have just guided me to answer the riddle I posted 25 years ago on my Steiner98 website where you and I first met in this incarnation. Now our shared destiny with anthroposophy has been fulfilled right here on Hazel’s substack!
And dear Hazel, with your indication of the “Golden Triangle” whose vertices are Rudolf Steiner, Marie Steiner and Ita Wegman, you provided me with the key that has unlocked the treasure chest containing the Karma of the Anthroposophical Society. (Actually, the treasure chest is really a Pandora’s Box, but I digress.)
So let us go back to the beginning of it all, to Gilgamesh and Eabani/Enkidu.
So, if Gilgamesh the King is Ita Wegman, and Eabani the Wildman is Rudolf Steiner, then who is Marie Steiner? Obviously, she is the go-between, the mediating figure, namely, Shamhat, the sacred prostitute of the Temple of Inanna/Ishtar who is sent by Gilgamesh to seduce Eabani and tame his wildness.
But we must also remember that the gods created Eabani in order to oppose the arrogance, oppression and tyranny of King Gilgamesh, who was a sexual predator extraordinaire and utterly lacking in empathy for his subjects.
Now I cite my email of Mary 29, 1999 as it appeared on the mailing list I called Steiner98. I quote an excerpt below.
“ . . . here is the future Rudolf Steiner, as the wild man Enkidu, getting his chimes rung for six DAYS and seven NIGHTS!!! A full matrifructifying WEEK!!! Is this in the Guinness Book of World Records or what?
For anthroposophists anyway, this has to be the most stupendous "Fuck-a-thon" in all of human history! I mean, in the opening of Genesis, we have the Seven Days of Creation; but in the Gilgamesh epic, we have the Seven Nights of Fructification. Wow!
What a way for Rudy boy to get literally sucked down into earthly incarnation! For it was this event that brought Enkidu out of the spiritual Cosmos and down to earth, so he could begin the handful of incarnations that would lead to the man we know and love as Rudolf Steiner.”
————————
Now, 25 years later, I recognize the priestess-seductress as Marie Steiner so now I can also understand her jealousy of Ita Wegman.
Think about it! Here we have Eabani-Steiner fucking the bejeesus out of Shamhat von Sievers for 6 days and 7 nights, but she’s only doing it under strict orders from the arrogant tyrant and predatory serial and sexual abuser, Gilgamesh-Wegman!!!
Now let’s bring the karmic niceties into their latest incarnations.
Steiner meets Marie in 1902.
Ita Wegman does not come on the scene until 1912.
Ita is 9 years younger than Marie.
Rudy & Marie marry on Christmas Eve 1914.
For the next 10 years, Rudy bonds deeper and deeper with Ita while he treats Marie like a Putzfrau (cleaning lady) or at least his executive secretary who is expected to do all the drudgework while he and Ita spoon about their past lives together.
And let’s not even mention Ita being with Rudy on his deathbed while Marie does eurythmy in Stuttgart.
Of course, Tom, you know that 25 years ago you were pulling out all stops to be as controversial as possible. Your aim was to oppose the flower-children of Lucifer on the Anthroposophia Ark. Remember your logic of bringing the fetid stink of Ahriman to bear upon the proceedings? I found it brilliant, and yet knew very little about the opposing factions. You see, I had studied Anthroposophy all alone by myself until 1998, when I was first able to introduce myself on Steiner98 by saying something about what had taken place in my life in early May of 1980, which was the experience of the Etheric Christ. So, you'll like this because it was exactly 18.6 years from May 8, 1980, and the experience of the Etheric Christ, to Thanksgiving 1998, and my introduction to you on Steiner98. You see, I felt I needed to find an audience, and it took that long to find it. You gave it in spades, and we have had many other conversations over the years, some good and some bad. Thanks for still being around, like me.
So, Tom, you see that I am trying to have a conversation with you after many years. Is it too difficult to just write back? Our approbation over the years has a spiritual history that is being recorded, as we speak. It is disappointing to think that we can't even have a conversation, when the world turns on what it all means. We have the ability to make a difference. That is why I have pretty much given up on 'anthropop' conversations, and instead, trying to find the larger audience. Yet, people really do want to know what this all means. That is why we can't get away from it. For example, Lady D. It allowed us to say something next. Yet, where it goes, nobody knows.
Well, Steve, "the time is at hand." Our karmic ducks are finally lined up in a row. The last one was the amazing memorial service for David Tresemer I attended on Zoom this past Sunday. And now you and I can arrange our meeting in private because Substack now has a chat feature.
I will contact you there and we can set up a meeting. The only stipulation is that our contact must be video and audio in order that we can each exercise the 12th Sense of Ego with each other to the maximum extent that Ahriman allows.
We can then figure out the means, whether Zoom, Skype, FaceTime, et al.
& of course as you say Shamhat had a role to play, bringing the wild man into incarnation.
But I don't think every incarnation involved all three.
Ita Wegman met Rudolf Steiner in 1909 after a lecture when he was standing next to Marie, but they didn’t start really working together since Wegman was away for many years becoming a doctor. It was only in the last part of Steiner's life where they reignited their deep relationship – which has a completely different character then the connection Steiner had with Marie.
The tone of the relationship between Wegman & Steiner is well illustrated in the Gilgamesh example as loving friends who would willing die for each other.
Marie was a divine spiritual being, which was seen especially in her lives as Orpheus, & as Albertus Magnus, even Hypatia (& if you like as the goddess Shamhat) …As Marie Steiner she was the formative force that helped Rudolf bring Anthroposophy to bear in the world - she was the 1st to embody Anthroposophia!
In this golden triangle we see different forms of love.
Now it’s the base of the triangle that has to be reconciled – which did happen between them at the end of their lives…
It is we – those of us here now that have to reconcile ourselves to see that each of these powerful human beings holds an equally important role in the whole. Blaming Marie will keep us stuck in the adversarial web
It was Rudolf Steiner that recapitulated the trek to the Burgenland of Austria when he was a boy, living in Neudorf, Hungary, but attending the Real Schule in Weiner Neustadt, Austria, from age 11 to 18, c. 1872-1879.
"I had now to go every day from Neudörfl to Wiener Neustadt. In the morning I could go by train; but I had to come back in the afternoon on foot, since there was no train at the right time. Neudörfl was in Hungary, Wiener Neustadt in Lower Austria. So every day I went from “Transleitanien” to “Cisleitanien.” (These were the official designations for the Hungarian and the Austrian districts.)"
This makes it readily apparent that it was Rudolf Steiner who was reliving an important episode in his former life as Gilgamesh, and not Eabani. This is a game-changer in support of the nonsense that has been circulating for some years now. I recently read again the pertinent lectures in GA 233, "World History in the Light of Anthroposophy".
Steiner infers again and again that it was Gilgamesh who reincarnated as Aristotle in order to attend Plato's Academy for 20 years, and then leave in order to tutor the 13 year old Alexander.
We have to remember that our lives are pure recapitulations, we develop new capacitates in each life. Wegman/Gilgamesh was an old soul with several earlier incarnations.
Steiner had resided longer than most in the spiritual world, perhaps working with the Nathan soul & the Christ in the pre-earthly deeds, one of his 1st incarnations was as Eabani who was a guide to Gilgamesh after he died working thru him, just like John the Baptist did with the Disciples & with Lazarus John in particular -
so Yes, Steiner, as a boy, recapitulated the trek to the Burgenland of Austria when he was living in Neudorf, Hungary.
Read the myth.
Sure, Eabani was a wild man – unschooled & awkward, as Steiner was, in the physical world, but he brought with him great Powers & wisdom from the spiritual world to help his beloved friend.
The people drawn to take up the initiative of the daughter movements were judged with suspicion by the old guard who were stuck in the intellect.
Marie Steiner, as well as many others, were put off by the burgeoning clairvoyance that was showing itself in Ita Wegman. The rivalry was already present in their lives around Thomas Aquinas – with the entelechy of Marie working thru his teacher Albertus Magnus & Reginald of Piperno his close confessor. Jealousy is one of the deadly sins
It is a matter of doing intense Anthroposophical research & then working it into the soul forces, moving the connections & clues thru Imagination, Inspiration into Intuition, infused with common sense & a lot of grace from the spiritual world - to correctly read what is imprinted.
The good gods like Michael are wanting to work with us, we are meant to take up the cosmic intelligence, but we have to do it consciously with intention.
Well, I am attempting to do just that with the Mystery-Pageant that we will 'perform' at the Eclipse Convergence. It has leading thoughts in the form of dialogue interspersed with singing & eurythmy…
Hi Tom,
I don't want to lose sight of this, as it seems important. About seven years ago you asked about the Mars genie behind Loyola and Voltaire. As such, I see a lot of Voltaire in you. Have you ever made the distinction? You have the sonnets and plays in your background, as well the Voltaire education; Jesuit for him, Catholic for you. The consideration is rather overwhelming for me, and I don't want to lose it. All, of course, in the modern frame of reference. Here was the comment:
https://open.substack.com/pub/hazelarcherginsberg/p/the-karma-of-exclusion?r=2kbdzg&utm_campaign=comment-list-share-cta&utm_medium=web&comments=true&commentId=51104617
Voltaire was also noted for his satirical humor, and could be a vicious critic, like with Christianity. Tom is noteworthy for his, "Mythery of Golgotha", but he grew up Catholic, which could have something to do with it. Loyola's past can be traced to Muhammad, who brought the Koran out of the cave when he was forty, c. 610 AD. He was close to the influences of the Academy of Jundi-Shapur, and possessed a kind of premature consciousness soul, which facilitated his inspirations through the Archangel Gabriel. As Steiner indicates in GA 184, the religious system of Islam, based on the Koran, served to "skim the cream off the top of the Academy of Jundi-Shapur".
"Above all in those regions where it was wished to spread the Gnostic wisdom of Jundí Sábúr, Mohammed took the ground from under its feet. He skimmed the cream off it, and so the Jundí Sábúr influence was left to trail behind and could accomplish nothing in face of what Mohammed had done. Here you can see the wisdom in world-history; we come to know the truth about Mohammedanism only when, in addition to other things, we know that Mohammedanism was destined to deaden the Gnostic wisdom of Jundí Sábúr, to take from it the strong Ahrimanically seductive force which would otherwise have been exercised upon mankind." GA 184, lecture V
One last item of note concerning the pretext and basis for Rudolf Steiner going to the Realschule in Wiener-Neustadt, Austria, for his middle school education, which is intended to speak volumes to the Gilgamesh incarnation, c. 2500 BC, is that when the boy was eight years old, and living in Pottschach, Hungary, and just before moving to Neudorfl, he had an occult experience while sitting in the Pottschach railway station. A person vaguely familiar walked into the station, and came over to him, and pleaded the words: "Try now and later to do for me as much as you can". Then, she continued to make gestures which imparted deep meaning to the little boy, and then walked over to the heat stove that warmed the office, and disappeared into it. This is the prefiguring event in the life of Rudolf Steiner. This occurrence caused the veritable lifting of the veil in the inception of the so-called, "being of anthroposophy". The little boy felt compelled to make inquiries for the first time in his life. You see, prior to this occurrence, it had all been: "In one ear and out the other", so to speak. So, the boy began to pay attention for the first time in his young life. He soon found out that his parents were both suffering a great tragedy that had just occurred. His aunt, who was his mother's second sister, had committed suicide, and had come to him immediately in her etheric body at the Pottschach location. Her imploring words and gestures had the effect of causing the boy to look at his worldview with a certain character and distinction for the first time. The Being of Anthroposophy was born. This is from the autobiographical lecture of February 4, 1913, given in Berlin, just one day after the lecture that invoked Dante's inspiration of his beloved, "Psychosophia", toward our "Anthroposophia".
It is possible from here to see all the underpinnings. An eight-year old boy suddenly becomes keenly curious about the outside world. His father begins to see a very keen mind at work, and eventually decides to send him to the Aristotle school, rather than the village gymnasium in Neudorfl, where he would have been taught by Cistercian monks. Steiner always considered this a blessing because he got that close to becoming a Cistercian himself. Then, his spiritual science would have become completely self-involved.
So, thanks to the Aunt who died, but instigated the, "Being Anthroposophia". It can be adduced that she was the reincarnated Dante in the nineteenth century, which Steiner had pointed out in the second lecture of GA 138, "Initiation, Eternity, and the Passing Moment". He points out how it was a big deal for him.
Here is what Rudolf Steiner says about this experience at the Pottschach station when he was about eight years old, and his discarnate Aunt came to him in her etheric body:
"Now, someone who experiences something like this in his early childhood and tries to understand it in accordance with the disposition of his soul, knows , if he experiences such a thing consciously, how one lives in the spiritual worlds. And since the instreaming illumination of the spiritual worlds is to be discussed here only in relation to points that are directly necessary, let it be suggested here at once that from that event onward a life in the boy's soul began to develop which thoroughly revealed to him the worlds out of which not only the outer trees, the outer mountains, speak to the human soul but also the worlds that are behind them. From that point in time onward, the boy lived with the spirits of nature, which can be observed quite particularly in such a region; he lived with the creative beings behind things, and he allowed them to work upon him in the same way as he allowed the outer world to work upon him."
Thus, the boy experienced the primal phenomena of the world. He was grafted into the underlying spiritual reality of every outer-external event that occurred, or ever could occur. The birth of Anthroposophy. He soon came to impress his father very much. Yet, the discarnate Aunt was to be the platform for something more. Her etheric appearance guided the boy to an experience that can be explained only out of the principles of spiritual economy. The boy received an astral body copy of the Master Jesus, who is the evolved Zarathustra, and his mission was set. The Autobiography of Rudolf Steiner really does explain this in great detail.
He never lost the spiritual geometry in which spiritual relationships usually decline into the linear and horizontal. Thus, he was initiated at a very young age. When he began to attend the Real Schule at age 11, he experienced a profound reminder of something that had happened once upon a time. He wrote about it when he was nearly 63 years old. By this time, it was a profound clue.
Yes, I know this is how you equate this experience, but I don't see Anthroposophia coming in until after Steiner sees that his teacher who was Plato in his last life couldn’t bring Anthroposophy into the world. He gives Steiner the opportunity to take up the Goethe relationship with guidance from the other side.
& then, when Steiner meets Marie, Anthroposophia comes in as a Cosmic Being, grounding that Being on earth for the 1st time.
The above quote is a powerful example of Steiner’s atavistic clairvoyance, which he then re-works thru the Rosicrucian path.
Yes, Karl Julius Schroer was one of the emissaries in the life path of Rudolf Steiner, beginning with the aunt, Felix, the layman that encouraged the Fichte studies, and then the Master himself. But, Steiner's clairvoyance was never atavistic, just a natural clairvoyance out of the state of "unbornness", which became more and more exact over the course of his life. Thus, Steiner was the very first to possess and display this future faculty of humanity. It marks our path of striving in this New Abraham Epoch.
"Frau Doctor Wegman was / is / & will continue to be, a co-worker with Rudolf Steiner – having served with him thru-out many life-times together."
This continues to be a matter of speculation. For example, Cratylus was not at Ephesus at the time of Heraclitus, but was a younger associate of Socrates some fifty years later, c. 430 BC. As such, Cratylus is immortalized in a dialogue of Plato, which Aristotle knew of, and made comment on, c. 360 BC. So, you see, this creates doubt concerning your whole thesis of past lives. "World History...." only brings us closer to Gilgamesh and Eabani, and their continuation at the Mystery of Ephesus, and then the historically relevant figures of Aristotle and Alexander some 150 years later, c. 384 & 356 BC. It is the three or four years that Aristotle taught the young Alexander that is most important. The intensity of it caused Alexander to completely remember his incarnation at Ephesus, and he attained self-realization for his mission as King of Macedonia. As such, he would spread the Aristotelian Knowledge of Nature as his conquering sword, and create the Hellenistic Corridor to the Promised Land for the Hebrews.
He was the Maitreya Bodhisattva, and duly prepared by Aristotle. Yes, they did have a keen and close legacy.
not sure I can reconcile the Maitreya connection.
But for sure whatever incarnations they share the important thing is that they work for Michael
The Maitreya connection was inserted especially to get your attention. You see, Steiner in his lectures on the Gospel of Mark, speaks of the comets of Buddha and Socrates. This is important because the comet of Gautama Buddha points back to his predecessor, who is Krishna, and the comet of Socrates points forward to John the Baptist, and Christ. This also is meant to indicate the passing of the Tiara from the Buddha to his successor, who is the Maitreya incarnation, which is Socrates. Yes, a philosopher succeeds Gautama Buddha. It is no less than Socrates. He especially sees the Aristotle- Alexander connection, and why he fuels the dialogues through Plato, who is his medium of contact.
https://rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA139/English/AP1986/19120918p01.html
Remember, Rudolf Steiner describes all this without inferring himself or Ita Wegman in it. Why should we? If Cratylus was not there at Ephesus, then does it not cause suspicion concerning the other entities? Again, for example. Rudolf Steiner as far as I know, never referred to Sigune or Schionatulander anywhere. And, Thomas Aquinas does not redeem Aristotle because *he* is Aristotle, but because he becomes the 12th in the College of Twelve with regard to the birth of Christian Rosenkreutz. This is described here in lecture 6 of GA 237, The School of Chartres, wherein Alain de Lille in old age prepares the birth of Thomas Aquinas for a special mission in the 13th century. The College of Twelve that surrounds the birth of Christian Rosenkreutz. So, there is a riddle here that links Aquinas to Aristotle.
https://rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA237/English/RSP1977/19240713p01.html
Once only did Aristotle and Alexander pay a fleeting visit to the earth in the first Christian centuries in a district not without interest for the Anthroposophical Movement. This visit together was their last time. Then, they returned to the spiritual world to continue to move forward. - Rudolf Steiner (sic)
“Christian doctors of the Church, their souls equipped with Aristotle, battling against those who had carried the other Aristotle across from Asia into Spain, spreading an unchristian doctrine. On all hands we see the conflict of Aristotelianism in the Christian fathers of the Church, we see it in the pictures that were painted in a later time, the Church fathers holding in their hand what they had gained from Aristotle, and treading under foot Averröes and the others who stood for their kind of Aristotelianism that had come through Alexandrianism into Europe. This was taking place externally. But at the same time, if we may describe it out of spiritual research, Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor lived on, having passed through the gate of death as I just indicated, and needless to say, Alexander and Aristotle themselves lived on. Once only they paid as it were a fleeting visit to the earth in the first Christian centuries in a district not without interest for the Anthroposophical Movement. Then they returned again into the spiritual world and they were together in the spiritual world at a certain time after Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor had left the physical plane once more. They themselves, the real individualities of Aristotle and Alexander, took different paths from Haroun al Raschid and his counsellor. For they went forward with the Christian evolution. They went westward with the evolution of Christianity.”
https://rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA238/English/APC1957/19240910a01.html
So, this would seem to further indicate that these supposed Steiner-Wegman incarnations are bogus. Yet, it is true that Rudolf Steiner as a boy went to school in the Burgenland of Austria, for seven years (1872-1879); a Realschule in the mold of Aristotle. His father thought he would make a good railway engineer.
Schionatulander & Sigune is what is indicated in that 'fleeting visit to the earth in the first Christian centuries'
Yes, a few people have come to believe that, but what if it can be shown that the incarnation is several centuries earlier, and closer to Christ? As well, if this was their last incarnation together, then this leaves out Aquinas-Piperno, and Steiner-Wegman. They went west with Christianity, but separately, after this final incarnation.
and where are they working now?
Hey Hazel,
Thank you once again for your courageous words today in the karma of exclusion. I really wonder how this tendency manages to continue into our times? This tendency to form polarized ‘cliques’ among Anthroposophists has always kept me somewhat aloof. When I ventured into deeper involvement, each time I felt pressured to join one clique against another. I'd witness people acting out of their double to covertly accuse others of behaviors they themselves indulged. It was painful. I’ve never understood why this happens so frequently among Anthropops. I’ve experienced nothing like that in the Christian Community or among BD folks. Do you think it’s still the conflict between Aristotelians and Platonists, or do you think there is a long shadow from RS lifetime that is still cast into our age? I have a feeling it’s an imbalance that develops from people who only study and don’t do any inner meditative work, or psychological work… Oh well, just wanted to thank you as ever, for your profound insights and wake up call!
love
Diana
Greetings Lady D - I do think part of the imbalance stems from a lack of self-knowledge, as you say, because folks would rather keep Steiner’s teachings theoretical & so that connects to the conflict between the Aristotelians & Platonists, & the lack of interest in working with Christ as Lord of Karma.
And perhaps it’s true that the sins of the original Vorstand linger…
The inner meditative, psycho-spiritual work is required, now more than ever, as the incarnation of Ahriman descends.
May our wakeful hoping bring us fortifying forces
In all truthfulness, and I like Diana's sentiments of the psychological baggage, it is really about people not doing the work. They make up excuses instead, and then wonder why it is falling apart, and being too theoretical. In reality, Rudolf Steiner advocated studying spiritual science every day in total conformity to the conceptual framework of the Intellectual Soul. This was the main gateway. No clairvoyance required at all. Then, what gets revealed soon after this takes place is how the soul begins to partake in a new process; the process of the Consciousness Soul. So, there can be no fault other than not doing the work of the acquisition of new knowledge. The so-called, "daughter movements ", which began in earnest in 1919, e.g., Waldorf, Threefolding, Anthro Medicine, Biodynamics, Camphill, were designed to give an outer expression to this theoretical/ conceptual framework. It would be wrong to point to it as causing the "karma of exclusion" in the destiny of Ita Wegman. In reality, it was Marie Steiner who ditched her, and she never explained it Likely, female jealousy, to give a convenient answer. The world turned on it.
Steve,
With your indication of Marie Steiner’s jealousy, you have just guided me to answer the riddle I posted 25 years ago on my Steiner98 website where you and I first met in this incarnation. Now our shared destiny with anthroposophy has been fulfilled right here on Hazel’s substack!
And dear Hazel, with your indication of the “Golden Triangle” whose vertices are Rudolf Steiner, Marie Steiner and Ita Wegman, you provided me with the key that has unlocked the treasure chest containing the Karma of the Anthroposophical Society. (Actually, the treasure chest is really a Pandora’s Box, but I digress.)
So let us go back to the beginning of it all, to Gilgamesh and Eabani/Enkidu.
So, if Gilgamesh the King is Ita Wegman, and Eabani the Wildman is Rudolf Steiner, then who is Marie Steiner? Obviously, she is the go-between, the mediating figure, namely, Shamhat, the sacred prostitute of the Temple of Inanna/Ishtar who is sent by Gilgamesh to seduce Eabani and tame his wildness.
But we must also remember that the gods created Eabani in order to oppose the arrogance, oppression and tyranny of King Gilgamesh, who was a sexual predator extraordinaire and utterly lacking in empathy for his subjects.
Now I cite my email of Mary 29, 1999 as it appeared on the mailing list I called Steiner98. I quote an excerpt below.
https://steiner98.tripod.com/enkidu.html
“ . . . here is the future Rudolf Steiner, as the wild man Enkidu, getting his chimes rung for six DAYS and seven NIGHTS!!! A full matrifructifying WEEK!!! Is this in the Guinness Book of World Records or what?
For anthroposophists anyway, this has to be the most stupendous "Fuck-a-thon" in all of human history! I mean, in the opening of Genesis, we have the Seven Days of Creation; but in the Gilgamesh epic, we have the Seven Nights of Fructification. Wow!
What a way for Rudy boy to get literally sucked down into earthly incarnation! For it was this event that brought Enkidu out of the spiritual Cosmos and down to earth, so he could begin the handful of incarnations that would lead to the man we know and love as Rudolf Steiner.”
————————
Now, 25 years later, I recognize the priestess-seductress as Marie Steiner so now I can also understand her jealousy of Ita Wegman.
Think about it! Here we have Eabani-Steiner fucking the bejeesus out of Shamhat von Sievers for 6 days and 7 nights, but she’s only doing it under strict orders from the arrogant tyrant and predatory serial and sexual abuser, Gilgamesh-Wegman!!!
Now let’s bring the karmic niceties into their latest incarnations.
Steiner meets Marie in 1902.
Ita Wegman does not come on the scene until 1912.
Ita is 9 years younger than Marie.
Rudy & Marie marry on Christmas Eve 1914.
For the next 10 years, Rudy bonds deeper and deeper with Ita while he treats Marie like a Putzfrau (cleaning lady) or at least his executive secretary who is expected to do all the drudgework while he and Ita spoon about their past lives together.
And let’s not even mention Ita being with Rudy on his deathbed while Marie does eurythmy in Stuttgart.
Of course, Tom, you know that 25 years ago you were pulling out all stops to be as controversial as possible. Your aim was to oppose the flower-children of Lucifer on the Anthroposophia Ark. Remember your logic of bringing the fetid stink of Ahriman to bear upon the proceedings? I found it brilliant, and yet knew very little about the opposing factions. You see, I had studied Anthroposophy all alone by myself until 1998, when I was first able to introduce myself on Steiner98 by saying something about what had taken place in my life in early May of 1980, which was the experience of the Etheric Christ. So, you'll like this because it was exactly 18.6 years from May 8, 1980, and the experience of the Etheric Christ, to Thanksgiving 1998, and my introduction to you on Steiner98. You see, I felt I needed to find an audience, and it took that long to find it. You gave it in spades, and we have had many other conversations over the years, some good and some bad. Thanks for still being around, like me.
So, Tom, you see that I am trying to have a conversation with you after many years. Is it too difficult to just write back? Our approbation over the years has a spiritual history that is being recorded, as we speak. It is disappointing to think that we can't even have a conversation, when the world turns on what it all means. We have the ability to make a difference. That is why I have pretty much given up on 'anthropop' conversations, and instead, trying to find the larger audience. Yet, people really do want to know what this all means. That is why we can't get away from it. For example, Lady D. It allowed us to say something next. Yet, where it goes, nobody knows.
Well, Steve, "the time is at hand." Our karmic ducks are finally lined up in a row. The last one was the amazing memorial service for David Tresemer I attended on Zoom this past Sunday. And now you and I can arrange our meeting in private because Substack now has a chat feature.
I will contact you there and we can set up a meeting. The only stipulation is that our contact must be video and audio in order that we can each exercise the 12th Sense of Ego with each other to the maximum extent that Ahriman allows.
We can then figure out the means, whether Zoom, Skype, FaceTime, et al.
Perhaps!?!
& of course as you say Shamhat had a role to play, bringing the wild man into incarnation.
But I don't think every incarnation involved all three.
Ita Wegman met Rudolf Steiner in 1909 after a lecture when he was standing next to Marie, but they didn’t start really working together since Wegman was away for many years becoming a doctor. It was only in the last part of Steiner's life where they reignited their deep relationship – which has a completely different character then the connection Steiner had with Marie.
The tone of the relationship between Wegman & Steiner is well illustrated in the Gilgamesh example as loving friends who would willing die for each other.
Marie was a divine spiritual being, which was seen especially in her lives as Orpheus, & as Albertus Magnus, even Hypatia (& if you like as the goddess Shamhat) …As Marie Steiner she was the formative force that helped Rudolf bring Anthroposophy to bear in the world - she was the 1st to embody Anthroposophia!
In this golden triangle we see different forms of love.
Now it’s the base of the triangle that has to be reconciled – which did happen between them at the end of their lives…
It is we – those of us here now that have to reconcile ourselves to see that each of these powerful human beings holds an equally important role in the whole. Blaming Marie will keep us stuck in the adversarial web
It was Rudolf Steiner that recapitulated the trek to the Burgenland of Austria when he was a boy, living in Neudorf, Hungary, but attending the Real Schule in Weiner Neustadt, Austria, from age 11 to 18, c. 1872-1879.
https://rsarchive.org/Books/GA028/English/APC1928/GA028_c02.html
"I had now to go every day from Neudörfl to Wiener Neustadt. In the morning I could go by train; but I had to come back in the afternoon on foot, since there was no train at the right time. Neudörfl was in Hungary, Wiener Neustadt in Lower Austria. So every day I went from “Transleitanien” to “Cisleitanien.” (These were the official designations for the Hungarian and the Austrian districts.)"
This makes it readily apparent that it was Rudolf Steiner who was reliving an important episode in his former life as Gilgamesh, and not Eabani. This is a game-changer in support of the nonsense that has been circulating for some years now. I recently read again the pertinent lectures in GA 233, "World History in the Light of Anthroposophy".
Steiner infers again and again that it was Gilgamesh who reincarnated as Aristotle in order to attend Plato's Academy for 20 years, and then leave in order to tutor the 13 year old Alexander.
We have to remember that our lives are pure recapitulations, we develop new capacitates in each life. Wegman/Gilgamesh was an old soul with several earlier incarnations.
Steiner had resided longer than most in the spiritual world, perhaps working with the Nathan soul & the Christ in the pre-earthly deeds, one of his 1st incarnations was as Eabani who was a guide to Gilgamesh after he died working thru him, just like John the Baptist did with the Disciples & with Lazarus John in particular -
so Yes, Steiner, as a boy, recapitulated the trek to the Burgenland of Austria when he was living in Neudorf, Hungary.
Read the myth.
Sure, Eabani was a wild man – unschooled & awkward, as Steiner was, in the physical world, but he brought with him great Powers & wisdom from the spiritual world to help his beloved friend.
The people drawn to take up the initiative of the daughter movements were judged with suspicion by the old guard who were stuck in the intellect.
Marie Steiner, as well as many others, were put off by the burgeoning clairvoyance that was showing itself in Ita Wegman. The rivalry was already present in their lives around Thomas Aquinas – with the entelechy of Marie working thru his teacher Albertus Magnus & Reginald of Piperno his close confessor. Jealousy is one of the deadly sins
Where do you get this stuff? The closest possible source is a couple of very indirect references in "Occult History", from December 1910, GA 126.
It is a matter of doing intense Anthroposophical research & then working it into the soul forces, moving the connections & clues thru Imagination, Inspiration into Intuition, infused with common sense & a lot of grace from the spiritual world - to correctly read what is imprinted.
The good gods like Michael are wanting to work with us, we are meant to take up the cosmic intelligence, but we have to do it consciously with intention.
You are preaching to the choir, here :)
With Verisimilitude,
Steve
sweet Z...
we must have Sun Karma -
Let's take it into a ritual rock opera omnia...
Well, I am attempting to do just that with the Mystery-Pageant that we will 'perform' at the Eclipse Convergence. It has leading thoughts in the form of dialogue interspersed with singing & eurythmy…
Come join us…